tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post6406716952424807976..comments2024-03-18T08:41:35.438-04:00Comments on Lovely Bicycle!: The Risky Business of Attracting WomenVelouriahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00359329171411037482noreply@blogger.comBlogger61125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-26929652362711191082012-09-29T05:05:47.928-04:002012-09-29T05:05:47.928-04:00It sometimes starts early, too: http://schlijper.n...It sometimes starts early, too: http://schlijper.nl/120927-01-theo-van-goghpark.photoFrits Bhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11399632570565541892noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-9103393147270930962012-09-29T05:00:40.128-04:002012-09-29T05:00:40.128-04:00Have you ever seen one of the Cycle Chic blogs, t...Have you ever seen one of the Cycle Chic blogs, this one in particular: http://www.copenhagencyclechic.com? Women, "girls", ride in the outfits shown there because they like it, not because they are forced to by their menfolk. Frits Bhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11399632570565541892noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-19616354032048954822012-09-26T19:30:36.960-04:002012-09-26T19:30:36.960-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.Images of Heavenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07583876078599605328noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-9384796630629187712012-09-25T14:52:47.853-04:002012-09-25T14:52:47.853-04:00If they're trying to sell more bikes to men, t...If they're trying to sell more bikes to men, this ad is certainly going to be a great eye-catcher for them. What many marketers fail to understand is that if you want to sell products to women, you should either depict a regular-looking but confident women, or show a sexy MAN in the image. <br /><br />- Jenny Kubicki, Marketer, Photographer, Graphic Designer, Confident Woman, Avid Cyclist.Jennyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13999756178229225019noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-3550164543450047362012-09-24T13:26:54.658-04:002012-09-24T13:26:54.658-04:00How about
this inspirational image?How about<br /><a href="http://microcosmpublishing.com/catalog/tshirts/3877/" rel="nofollow">this inspirational image</a>?Ellyhttp://takingthelane.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-13367028240037063842012-09-23T16:13:17.288-04:002012-09-23T16:13:17.288-04:00I guess I see Bikes Belong as one of the larger an...I guess I see Bikes Belong as one of the larger and more visible advocacy groups for transportation cyclists. Why separate the image from the mission of the organization in the first place? Bikes Belong should have the wit and acumen not only to promote cycling by women with humor and whimsy, but also to use those good tools to reach the rich variety of us disinclined to ride now.<br /><br />I think the image itself is new-fashioned in terms of how we see women portrayed by advocacy groups, manufacturers and bike publications like Momentum and Bicycle Times.<br /><br />With luck we will all one day become old ladies, or with less luck we may find our ability to ride compromised by injury or illness. Transporting children can complicate using a bike as well. In Europe ugly people ride too. Though we may like to think that advocacy per se is for other kinds of riders, my hope is that we all try to work for change in our own ways as much as possible, so that the largest number of people can actually just ride. It’s hard to say how good advocacy now might impact our own ability to stay on a bike in the long run.Chicargohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03166650767505966551noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-62190101354911312882012-09-22T12:15:24.442-04:002012-09-22T12:15:24.442-04:00This is precisely why I stay away from advocacy an...This is precisely why I stay away from advocacy and leave it to others. I am not an advocate. But more to the point, my personal opinion of this particular poster is actually completely irrelevant to the message of this post; the whole point is how subjective these things are and what this means for those trying to market to women. <br /><br />But back to the poster: Looking at the image in its own right (and not evaluating it as effective advocacy), I personally interpret it as a tongue-in-cheek picture done in the spirit of Las Vegas kitsch. I am not offended by it. I also know that it is just one of many posters Bikes Belong makes, so I don't read it as saying "you must look like this to cycle!!" <br /><br />Looking at the poster as a piece of advocacy and listening to feedback from others at Interbike, it seems to be 50/50 love/hate (regardless of viewer's gender funny enough!). That sort of stuff is just fascinating to me - you know, how complicated we are as humans and how much nuance is involved in how we interpret things. <br /><br />But as I was saying to others at the show, the problem I personally see with this poster communicating Bikes Belong's message is that it is too old fashioned. I mean it is literally a reworking of a retro poster. But Bikes Belong is a progressive organisation and this poster seems oriented toward a quaint past, not the future.Velouriahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00359329171411037482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-60626725362123227552012-09-22T11:46:52.315-04:002012-09-22T11:46:52.315-04:00The Bikes Belong poster is a perfect example of th...The Bikes Belong poster is a perfect example of the failure of advocacy to stop "marketing" to women riders and instead concentrate on building the infrastructure that women and families need to be on the road at all.<br /><br />This poster was probably designed by the usual advocacy PR age/gender person: a man between the ages of 28 and 35 who can ride pretty much how and where he likes. Not by a dumpy middle aged woman with three kids - me- who rides to school in a city with crappy traffic and little practical 8-80 infrastructure to help me get anywhere useful.<br /><br />As much as I love to read Lovely Bike I am surprised you actually like this poster- who is it for, really? What happens to that lady when she needs to actually get somewhere like the library? <br /><br />I don't expect reality from an advertisement but this Bikes Belong poster says I'll belong if I ditch the kids, 35 pounds, and any ability to carry anything useful. It says in effect that most of us who are women living women's lives with a real woman's body don't Belong. And that is the problem with women's bike blogging and the advocacy environment in general.<br /><br />If I can only belong looking sexy in my heels, great breasts, and little dress hauling three kids to school, the bar is still too high for the average woman and that is where any real cycling culture in America ends right now. <br />Chicargohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03166650767505966551noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-57931117556172541392012-09-22T08:21:11.279-04:002012-09-22T08:21:11.279-04:00Some day, this conversation will seem incredibly s...Some day, this conversation will seem incredibly silly if we, as a species, ever evolve past the point of primitive sexism.<br /><br />Re: ads depicting gals who are all wearing summer dresses, heels, and handbags: I always took these to be specifically directed at females who wanna ride around, but want to be able to do their usual thing in terms of clothing and accessories. Understandable, but a completely overused convention already. (The poster in the article above is, of course, ridiculous. But it is hardly offensive, if one can stop him/herself from needlessly jumping to conclusions.)<br /><br />Re: bicycle color schemes. I think the problem is that cycle manufacturers don't want to put out more than one (possibly 2) color schemes for a given model. The "solution" here would be to make the WSD bike in the "normal" color (ie, whatever the men's bike looks like, which to be fair, is typically NOT a male-oriented color-scheme) and then something lavender or fuchsia with pretty flowers or Hello Kitty stickers for the cavewomen who feel that this sort of gussying-up is necessary.<br /><br />Of course, in the name of egalitarianism, they'll need to make a "macho" version of the analogous men's bike in the line. I think I'll take one in royal blue with stickers depicting construction vehicles/trucks, rather than the dark grey one with the HeMan-on-Greyskull motif.<br /><br />-Rob<br />PS- Do ppl have these same conversations about automobiles? Vacuum cleaners? Blenders? A bike is a tool. Thankfully, it is one that encourages customization; folks who want their bike's aesthetics to underline their gender can certainly do that themselves with some paint, stickers, accessories, and ingenuity. To expect a bicycle manufacturer to come up with ways to help them express their identity as a human is utterly daft, and kinda sad.Screechhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15397676711365438175noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-42452293413079183272012-09-22T08:03:31.683-04:002012-09-22T08:03:31.683-04:00I don't mind the poster that much, but what I&...I don't mind the poster that much, but what I'd really like to see in cycling promotion is representations of a greater selection of body types. People of colour, disabled people, people who aren't thin, etc. There's this pervasive idea that advertising NEEDS to be "aspirational" (which usually means thin white conventionally attractive models/actors), but there is increasing research which shows that people are more likely to purchase or act if the people in the ad are like them. Imagine the poster not only with a man in a similar pose, but perhaps someone like actor Gabourey Sidibe ("Precious"). Someone like Australian Olympian skier and cyclist Michael Milton, who has one leg. Someone aged 75 or more. Does it still make sense?Yaranoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-477280549113635902012-09-21T10:53:07.420-04:002012-09-21T10:53:07.420-04:00Thanks for the link (here is a clickable version)....Thanks for the link (<a href="http://bicycling.com/blogs/fitchick/2012/09/18/an-open-letter-to-interbike/" rel="nofollow">here</a> is a clickable version). This is the second time Selene Yeager and I write about the same topic from different perspectives. There are indeed bikini-clad LV style glamour girls at Interbike selling various products and bikes. The funny thing is that I've heard men here complain about it as well as women. Velouriahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00359329171411037482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-83076933888617776822012-09-21T06:27:58.641-04:002012-09-21T06:27:58.641-04:00sigh, why is it always about looks and appearances...sigh, why is it always about looks and appearances and about the size of thighs with us women. guys want big muscular thighs to look powerful, and we want skinny ones to look good to guys. so sad. i'm a 105 lb woman btw, but i feel bad for the big sporty girls that might read some of these comments.<br /><br />i think this was a pretty good response to the representation of women at interbike: http://bicycling.com/blogs/fitchick/2012/09/18/an-open-letter-to-interbike/Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-48991949694990586752012-09-20T15:39:04.773-04:002012-09-20T15:39:04.773-04:00I bike year round in skirts and heels of varying f...I bike year round in skirts and heels of varying fullness and height. After 6 years of commuting in Boston, 5 since even a minor accident (which actually happened while I was clipped in), I don't think that there's anything inherently unsafe about riding a city bike in heels and skirts. I might not ride in super skinny stilettos or pencil skirts, but fortunately I don't have many of those in my closet anyway.<br /><br />Yes, I might ride faster if I clipped in and rode in kit, but I don't feel the need, especially to work. I haven't considered myself an athlete since I stopped running marathons years ago.<br /><br /> I wouldn't fault anyone for what shoes they liked and felt comfortable in, on or off the bike, I'm all about choices, and I hope that advocacy organizations can be too. Sport cycling is not the only way to be a real cyclist, nor is chic cycling, nor is transportation cycling. And there are lots of people (Velouria being a prime example) who ride different bikes differently in different clothes for different purposes.<br />This is hard to market to in one image, and as I believe someone posted above there are multiple images in the Bikes Belong campaign. Cyclerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12072776738519243521noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-87526093237395759272012-09-20T09:04:39.729-04:002012-09-20T09:04:39.729-04:00360 view of the Boardman Fi team carbon I mentione...360 view of the Boardman Fi team carbon I mentioned here; <br /> http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_storeId_10001_catalogId_10151_productId_777743_langId_-1_categoryId_165710Scottnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-43938609077017522472012-09-20T09:00:02.501-04:002012-09-20T09:00:02.501-04:00The picture looks like a character of you Velouria...The picture looks like a character of you Velouria. Perhaps the artist was inspired by your blog!<br /><br />Always looking out for a ladies racer for my wife and I love this one from UK builder Chris Boardman.<br /><br />http://www.boardmanbikes.com/fi/fi_road_team_carbon.html<br /><br />Scottnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-84202743596742331442012-09-20T07:23:18.110-04:002012-09-20T07:23:18.110-04:00You remind me of
http://www.thesartorialist.com/ph...You remind me of<br />http://www.thesartorialist.com/photos/on-the-street-eva-paris/<br /><br />That website is filled with nice photos of ladies wearing chic dresses while cycling.<br /><br />I'm not that stylish, though. I still dress for the bike, partly because I don't feel very skilful and I try to minimise distractions. I should make an effort...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-28696954319465764062012-09-20T05:15:52.068-04:002012-09-20T05:15:52.068-04:00I don't understand why manufacturers always th...I don't understand why manufacturers always think making something feminine means making it pink!! - how about a beautiful pale blue? or duck egg? (can't go wrong with Tiffany blue!) - or lime green? - or emerald green? - or red? - I have no desire for anything in either pink or purple!!Violetsrosenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-72941987704154044542012-09-20T04:08:56.452-04:002012-09-20T04:08:56.452-04:00Had I passed this poster, I would not even have gi...Had I passed this poster, I would not even have given it a second glance. I cannot understand all the fuss. Honestly. It's girl wearing a dress on a bike, in what seems to be, in a hurry to meet a date.<br /><br />I have always respected women as equals, and it seems to me as if somebody is trying to stir a pot of nothingness into a whirlwind. <br /><br />I read this blog everyday, not because Madame Velouria is a woman, but because I am always astounded by her cycling knowledge.<br /><br />My older Goth daughter has a black/green BMX , my younger, Roxy, has a blue/silver MTB, and the wife has an old cherished PINK Raleigh Camaro, which she has bedecked with flowers.<br /><br />And my fixie is a somber Matte Black throughout... including fixtures. <br /><br />So as you can see, it is difficult to categorize people, men or women.<br /><br />Maybe I'm wrong, in which case, I apologize.Chris Grillohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13233463018653928311noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-57418740772369251162012-09-20T03:40:54.061-04:002012-09-20T03:40:54.061-04:00You can wear makeup and dress fashionably and stil...You can wear makeup and dress fashionably and still not want to be objectified. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-86936282551417528502012-09-20T03:01:20.798-04:002012-09-20T03:01:20.798-04:00Regarding the poster it is marketing,not documenta...Regarding the poster it is marketing,not documentary, it is IMO a bit silly to judge marketing on whether it is realistic or not.<br /><br />Marketing tends to objectify regardless what it is selling.<br />In this case we have a ladies bicycle that they are obviously trying to market to women who would like to identify with the general idea of an attractive young woman in the poster. My impression is a single (or at least open to suggestions) woman without kids who cares what she looks like.<br /> <br />A poster trying to sell a recliner chair for kids would give of a more sturdy and safe feeling (object: safe and happy kid and family), I bet they would be wearing helmets. A Rapha poster would contain exquisite suffering and so on.Johan Tnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-15209389366769018342012-09-20T01:39:48.182-04:002012-09-20T01:39:48.182-04:00Heather
Cycling does not cause bulk. Bradley Wigg...Heather<br /><br />Cycling does not cause bulk. Bradley Wiggins is 6'3" and weighs 150 pounds. That's what a cyclist looks like.<br /><br />In my part of the world the fast rider is a lady named Leigh Thompson. Fast as in she beats all the men. She is quite photogenic and a World Champion and you can find photo galleries of her all over the webs. The first thing you'll note in her photos is she just has no visible musculature. None. And she beats all the local men. Not those in her category. All of them. I should also mention that Leigh is old enough to be V's mother.<br /><br />If you mash gears all the time you'll get big legs. If on the other hand you pedal at all correctly one of the tokens of a cyclist is long lean calves. Cycling is not caber toss. It is not WWF. Leigh Thompson is fast without muscle because she pedals beautifully. Grace and style will trump beef every time.<br /><br />If you want to be a specialist in the kilometer or in match sprinting you will likely end up with some bulk. Although there have been a lot of skinny sprinters. Otherwise when cyclists get bulky it's because they ride clumsily. And don't know where the target is.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-79362972253373814482012-09-20T00:22:56.059-04:002012-09-20T00:22:56.059-04:00Another way to look at that poster, particularly g...Another way to look at that poster, particularly given the type of bike portrayed, is that it says that riding a bicycle is fun and sexy and something that conventionally attractive people do while wearing conventionally fashionable clothing; as opposed to something limited to fitness freaks, scruffy-bearded hipsters, and diehard fanatics in funny-looking sport-specific superhero suits. And in a way, the spindly legs and barbie-doll proportions actually contribute to the idea that bicycling is easy and fun if even a skinny bimbo can enjoy it, where a muscle-bound amazon (or a man, for that matter) could make it look like something only some people can do.<br />Yeah, she's an object. She's in an ad. People in ads are objects, there to sell you on a product or an idea or a look or whatever.<br /><br />Personally, I often feel like a lot of the "women-specific" outdoor gear out there is as much dreamed up by marketing departments trying to break into a new demographic as it is actually designed to solve problems unique to women. Sometimes there may be a fine line between what really needs to be re-designed to work or fit better, what could just be made in a wider range of sizes and accomplish the same thing, and what just has a lot of pastels and girl power imagery on the hang tag. As consumers, we like to feel that companies are responding to what we want; but we don't like to feel that we're being pandered to or exploited. And sometimes that's a fine line, too.Emily O'Brienhttp://www.dillpicklegear.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-51369373619321205552012-09-19T22:48:45.779-04:002012-09-19T22:48:45.779-04:00I like the poster. I says to me that I don't h...I like the poster. I says to me that I don't have to change who I am and what I wear because I want to get from point A to point B on a bike. Not all people who ride bikes consider themselves athletes (or even athletic). It took me years to move from thinking that my commute would be simpler and cheaper by bike to actually purchasing a bike - because all I could see out-and-about were lycra clad roadies and that wasn't appealing to me. I ride my bike in whatever clothes and shoes I'm wearing that day, skirts or pants, heels or flats. In fact the only shoes I've ever had problems with were a pair of ballet flats with smooth soles. <br /><br />I think the poster a great point for discussion though, because it clearly appeals to some women and not others, and the bike industry should understand that not all women are the same. Some love pink, some hate pink, some are sporty and feminine and want to reflect both in their choice of bike and clothing. Good job Velouria - I think this is an important issue.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-91031705279142486252012-09-19T22:14:21.242-04:002012-09-19T22:14:21.242-04:00As much as I hate to admidt it, the orange and blu...As much as I hate to admidt it, the orange and blue of the VO mixte wasn't feminine enough for me either. Soft colours are a great way to be feminine with out it looking like the target market is my three year old who wants hot pink. Lavender (esp metallic) soft greens or pale blues would be nice. I think that this is something that Bobbin does well.<br /><br />I know this is pots and not bikes, but this gal did a nice job of explaining how colour options impact her perception of the product. And as much as this is kind of silly, I would be happy with a bike in pretty much any of the Le Creuset coloursErin Bhttp://bikestheuniverseandeverything.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6467858377106451384.post-22394377078801491322012-09-19T21:25:11.244-04:002012-09-19T21:25:11.244-04:00The coolest thing in my neck of the woods with reg...The coolest thing in my neck of the woods with regard to attracting women to cycling is the number of women working in bike shops. I can think of four shops within about a ten mile radius and there must be close to a dozen women (or more!) who are knowledgable, experienced and friendly now greeting customers and providing assistance. They are not all racers and have a variety of backgrounds but one thing held in common is a commitment to cycling and sharing their enthusiasm. With more women opening up shops, building bikes, designing products, and of course commuting, I think good things are coming. Of course this is not marketing but, rather, living.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com